I don’t have any experience of work, but I have portfolio with my studied projects. I am from Ukraine and I wanna get internship in Europe. How can I do that?
P.S. I learn front end and I don’t have any money for lawyers.
This is all guesswork on my part, but…
By “in Europe” I assume that you mean “in the EU”. Since the Ukraine is not a member of the EU, I think this is going to be difficult. (I know Ukraine has a special relationship with the EU, but I don’t know how that affects employment.)
So I imagine it is going to be the same for you as it is for other non-EU people - difficult. Add on to this that getting that first job is hard even under the best of circumstances, then this is very difficult. If you were an experienced dev, then there might be a company willing to go to the trouble to sponsor you, but even that can be difficult.
My advice would be to keep learning and keep building things. Work on open source. See if you can get an internship or job in the Ukraine. Build up your portfolio and resume as much as possible. If those are good enough, you might get a job off of that. Try some freelance sites and build up your portfolio that way. There may also be a company willing to hire remotely, but it might be hard to get that job without some real experience.
My advice - build and learn. When you get tired of that, learn and build. If you keep doing that, eventually your skills will intersect with the market. It’s really difficult to get that first job. Just keep at it, build that resume and portfolio any way you can.
No. Ukraine doesn’t have any relationship with the EU.
I was seeing yet. It’s unreal. Ukraine is super anti-programmers country.
I was trying in upwork and freelancer, but it has very huge competition(especially from Indian developers).
I wanna get first job for office, I think office is better for interns, because it has better communication with other developers.
I very long time do it. I wanna work yet.
You said that it doesn’t help. Lol
Just found this on the interwebs …
I used to work Saturdays with two university students from Ukraine in Austria … Not sure whether they had any limits regarding hours or total earnings, but I assume that would cover internships. If it’s an option for you, maybe you could get in via a student visa as well. Studying in the EU doesn’t have to cost a lot and you could drop out, if you don’t want to spend all the time …
I am sorry, I have only 400$.
Yeah, there is a lot of competition on upwork. But it is also a way to get some experience. I figured that if I’m going to be learning, I might as well get paid a little. I didn’t take big projects and didn’t make ridiculously low bids, but I did get a few jobs and they helped when I applied to a real job. I also think there are outsourcing companies in the Ukraine. I don’t know if they do internships, but you can ask.
I’m sorry if you’re in a difficult place to find work. But presumably someone somewhere needs a web site. You can also try and build your own site. Learn how to do mobile development and you can make games. You’ll learn a lot. Just start building stuff.
You can also look for other developers in your area, like here, here, or here. Talking with other devs can be encouraging, informative, and a lot of jobs come from “knowing someone”.
I’m sorry that I don’t have an easy answer for you. It’s hard for all of us to get that first job. It’s going to be harder for you. But it is possible. But build and learn and learn and build. And start applying and working on your resume and work on your interviewing skills. Here is some general advice I have on finding that first job.
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I see that there are some bootcamps in Kiev. I would want to talk to them and find out what I could work out with them. I don’t know how much they charge, but some offer scholarships and some offer a “pay after you’re hired” option. Are there any government programs to help with tuition? Grants or loads? Maybe a rich uncle?
Yes, Ukraine has departments of EPAM, Luxoft and GlobalLogic, but in the Ukraine they recruit Senior levels developers only.
You said that it doesn’t help, because EU employers don’t wanna recruit foreign developers without any experience of working .
Do you mean programming courses?
No, definitely no. Ukraine is super anti-programmers country.
Yes. bootcamps are short, intensive course, usually from a few weeks to a few months. They often have job placement programs.
but in the Ukraine they recruit Senior levels developers only.
Right … but … those seniors are coming from where? Get on linkedin, connect with some of them, find out what they say. Clearly some developers are being created in the Ukraine. Reach out. Connect on linkedin. Go to meetups. See if there are facebook groups. Reach out to the bootcamp teachers and ask their advice. Find people and ask them.
You said that it doesn’t help, because EU employers don’t wanna recruit foreign developers without any experience of working .
Apply in the Ukraine then. Apply. There are jobs, I guarantee it. here, here, and here
You seem really focussed on the obstacles. You need to focus on the path - there is one. There’s probably more than one. I’m not saying it’s easy, but if all you want to do is list the reasons why you can’t do it, then I guess in the end you’ll prove yourself right. Stop worrying about the difficulties you can’t change and focus on finding ways around.
No one Ukrainian programmers course doesn’t help to find job.
My network of contacts in Linkedin doesn’t allow me to do it.
These jobs for developers with too big experience of working
Because I am from Ukraine.
I focus on this thing, but it’s a trap.
Even if they don’t have an explicit program (which I find hard to believe), the network of people you meet is invaluable. Again a lot of jobs come from people you know, in your network. About half of my serious job opportunities came from people I met in FCC and at meetups.
My network of contacts in Linkedin doesn’t allow me to do it.
That’s not how linkedin works. You can reach out and connect to people. This is a fundamental aspect of linkedin. Perhaps you’re on the wrong site. Search for the companies and find people. Or search by location. I am a React developer and when I type “Kiev React” into the search, I get over 2.5k hits. And for “Kiev javascript” I get 10k. If I wanted to, I could request a connect to any of them and message them. I know because I recently did something very similar because I want to move cities. Some of them will connect, and some of those would love to talk about what you can do. Do not underestimate how helpful developers can be. And don’t tell me that linkedin can’t do what linkedin was designed to do.
These jobs for developers with too big experience of working
You must be a very fast reader if you read all of those and analyzed them that fast. You should get a job as a speed reader if you went through hundreds (maybe thousands) of job postings. You don’t need to qualify for every job. You need to qualify and (hopefully) get one job! No one qualifies for every job. If are intent on only focusing on the jobs for which you won’t qualify, you will never get a job. When I was looking for a job, I didn’t qualify for 99.99% of the jobs. So I ignored those and focused on the ones where I had a chance.
Again, you seem focused on complaining about problems rather than finding solutions. I’m not saying it’s easy - it’s not. It’s hard. It’s hard for everyone. It was hard for me because I was trying to do this at 50 years old in a city flooded with young, good programmers with more experience. But I just didn’t give up.
You’ve gotten a lot of good advice here. I’ve linked you to a document on my advice. Stop complaining about what is hard and get to work.
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Any programming course is expensive for me. I am not rich.
Federal Communications Commission?
It’s true.
No. See my screenshot.
I everyday use these websites. I know every job from these sites, because they are the most popular job sites in the Ukraine. Around 2-3 years I every day reed jobs in these sites.
Everyone from them need Seniors, not Interns.
It’s unreal. It’s a trap.
Maybe you should look for other work that you won’t view as impossible. It sounds like you are your own biggest obstacle.
" Whether you think you can, or you think you can’t – you’re right."
- Henry Ford
FCC = Free Code Camp
It’s unreal. It’s a trap.
Then I don’t know what you want from us. You won’t listen to advice, you seem content to just tell us that everything is impossible. I know there are developers in the Ukraine - I can see them on linkedin. Go ask them! They will tell you the same things that we are telling you but maybe you will believe them. Or maybe you’ll just tell them that they’re wrong, that there are no developers in the Ukraine because they are anti-developer there and no one in the Ukraine ever learned how to program and no one there ever got a job, except for a few senior devs that magically sprang from the ground fully formed.
I don’t know what to tell you, man. It’s hard work. You need persistence and resiliency. You need a good attitude to stick with this. I think you have to decide which is more important to you - your goals or your fatalistic pessimism.
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Linkedin doesn’t work. I proved it to you yet. Because I have my own screenshot. See my screenshot several times.
I don’t think you’re understanding. Search for “kiev javascript” in the search (or whatever tech you like). There will be a list of potential contacts under " People results for kiev javascript". Hit the “See All”. Go down and start connecting.
Judging by your screenshot, you haven’t finished filling out your account. Fill it out. There is a card for “Build Your Network”. I don’t know, that might have something to do with building your network.
When I do a job search for “kiev javascript”, this comes back as an associate level job. If you work had enough, learn enough, build enough good projects, you might get hired on at that level. Follow them on linkedin. Connect with their engineers and ask them for advice. Connect with their hiring manager. If your close to being good enough, apply for the job - even if you’re not right for that position, they might keep you in mind for something else. They might know someone that needs someone at your level.
But if all you can do is complain and feel sorry for yourself, then yes, I agree, it will be 100% impossible for you to get that job.
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This topics has been closed to prevent it from getting too heated. I believe the information has run its course.
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