Job market after COVID-19, what do you think?

So, it seems to be a tough job market at the moment due to COVID-19 and all that, but what do you think will happen afterwards?
In my experience more and more companies were shutting their doors to juniors even before the pandemic. Will this get better afterwards? Will we move towards a new stage where a masters degree and 3-5 years of experience is the new baseline for a junior position?

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Considering the fact that it is possible to get hired without a bachelor’s degree, I find it unlikely that a master’s will become a requirement, except for a handful of very specalized positions.

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I think tech is something that slightly differs in that unlike a lot of jobs, which more or less are “static” in what you need to know, and do. Tech changes constantly. This means there is a lot of churn in the industry over time, as such finding someone with 10+ years of experience in a given technology might just not be possible, if that tech is less than 10 years old.

Its true some concepts have stuck around and wont ever go away, regardless of the tech. But a lot of practical skills required are very much tied to the technology being used. Because of this junior developers will always have a chance.

There will also be continued demand in the field, as software will continue to be created and used. The US Bureau of Statistics see’s a continued increase in software developer jobs in the future. So there should still be a demand of jobs and will need a continued increase in developers to fill them. :slight_smile:

Specifically for a Masters degree, I agree with above. A Masters degree isn’t required for a majority of software developer jobs. I believe practical skills, with knowledge of the underlying theory and fundamentals to be the most important. The practical skills are applicable now with current technology, and the underlying theory knowledge helps with future ones. You don’t need a high dept understanding through a Masters to be able to do most jobs, or be able to adapt for future ones.

Keep learning, keep building! :smiley:

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I think this highly depends on the company.

For every 1 Google/Facebook/Apple etc., there are 100.000 unknown companies.

The bigger a company, the more specific the jobs are.

Google probably doesn’t need many generalists who can learn everything.
They need folks who write high-performance PostgreSQL database queries where every millisecond counts. And for this kind of job it makes sense to filter candidates for a lot of experience and maybe a PhD in Computer Science with their PhD thesis about PostgreSQL.

And even if there are generalist fullstack devs in Google, probably 1.000 folks apply, so the probability is probably higher that a MS or BS is a good (aka return on invest-wise) filter.

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In my experience even the small no name companies were expecting a degree and several years of experience.

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Job details always include this stuff.
This filters out all people with low confidence about their skills.

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There are plenty of hiring managers that have confirmed this.
I once listened to a podcast where the hiring manager admitted that sometimes they put “nice to have skills” on there knowing that no one is going to perfectly match all of the criteria.

Unfortunately, a lot of qualified applicants probably don’t apply because they think they will get rejected right away because they don’t meet all of the criteria.

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I feel the first junior role is and will continue being a numbers game. You may need to start at a smaller company, like I did.

My girlfriend did a bootcamp and landed a job at larger company, as did many of the people in her cohort. So the brick and mortar bootcamp may make it easier to get a job at an established company, but idk. This is anecdotal.

Masters degree job requirement? Unlikely. By the time you get through school the tech you started with will be on the way out for the new tech that’s on the rise.

The FCC curriculum can get you the skills you need to make huge contributions to any company. I built the platform for about half of my company’s business, and am building a platform for the other half now. In addition, I’ve solved a number of bugs, added features, and built several smaller platforms for more specific use cases.

At the end of the day, making a component with a front end library, styling with CSS, hitting APIs… that’s all that some small companies need and none of their non-technical staff can do it for them. And they’re not gonna pay $150k for someone with experience to do something they can guide a fresh dev through.

COVID has potentially increased competition in that job openings are down, and offices are closed. Offices closed and many companies have expanded their search and now offer remote positions. So geographical competition is increased. That being said, many companies still have a strong traditional culture and want that local candidate for “when COVID is over.”

Personally, I filter those companies, others might do the opposite.

So whereas I sent out 35 applications, nowadays you might need 150. Jobs aren’t gone though, competition is just a bit more.

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I have applied for jobs with this exact mindset. It didn’t end well. Recruiter spent the interview chewing me out for having the audacity to apply. On the other hand, I applied for a job where I spoke directely to the technical staff. I didn’t get the job but they were really nice about it and told me what I needed to improve.

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If a recruiter does that, they are acting incredibly unprofessionally. That is not normal.

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Their loss I guess, best to just try to grow from the setback.

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Unfortunately, that recruiter was really unprofessional.
I wouldn’t categorize all recruiters that way.

Covid has been tough on every industry.
Right now it is tough to get a job.

But I really don’t think this is going to be the new norm.
There will be companies that will still hire junior developers.

This is just a tough season right now.

The good news is at least you are getting interviews.
There are a lot of people on the forum trying to apply for jobs that haven’t even gotten to that stage.

So they are interested enough to talk with you or else they would have ignored you and never reached out.

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The episode was before COVID. Now I am not applying anymore, because everywhere seems to have raised the bar.

Well I am sorry that you are having bad experiences with the interview process.

But you do have to remember that there is something in your application that is prompting people to reach out and interview you.

If you comb through the forum, there are a lot of people who have applied to countless places and not even received one interview.

I would hope you try and apply for jobs again and maybe it is just a matter of finding that right employer.

Just out of curiosity, where are you based?

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If you want a job, best advice I can give is create a schedule. Timebox to 1 hour per day. Use your coding skills to automate, can even fire up my job search bot on my GitHub. Make a bank of resume bullet points and cover letter paragraphs.

Don’t fool around with apply on company site, only do instant applies. Don’t waste time on recruiters as a junior, you’re not what most of them are looking for.

3-5 applications/day. Only for ads posted in the last 24 hours, with Junior or Associate in the title. Then continue doing whatever else it is you want to do with your life.

I’m based in Europe. The interview that stung the most was when they were really really interested until they learned that I had another degree than what they were looking for.
Then I was just dropped. Oddly enough I have aquaintances with no degree whatsoever who worked for the same company. That is what I mean by the bar beeing raised.