What is The Correct Learning Path in SE or Full Stack Web Developing

Career Advice
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To me it sounds like you are describing a tutor, not a mentor. I think that’s what a lot of people think a mentor is. To me a mentor is more high level, big picture career guidance. Your mentor isn’t the person you call at 2:30pm on a Saturday to explain to you how closure works.

There are different types of meetups. Sometimes it is just hanging out. Sometimes you take turns teaching lessons. Sometimes you work on algorithm challenges. There are a lot of different types.

But one thing you always get is a chance to network and share advice. Those are both good things.

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There are websites that exist for finding (and becoming) coding mentors, like this one: https://www.codementor.io/

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27

Thank you for real! Please, have a nice day :innocent:

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pick one, and as soon as you have the basics down, build projects - programming is learnt through doing, as you have short time, you will need to put your efforts where it counts. And that is building stuff. And then when you get stuck or you find out that you are missing something to do what you want, search and learn that specific thing.

A full-stack app would do a lot of good in your portfolio.

Also, contribute to open-source, and teach others.

The freeCodeCamp community is here to help. There is at least a dozen full-time programmers that spend a lot of their time answering questions, plus all the others that come to the forum now and then.

Check the Virtual Coffee community, @jwilkins.oboe is a member, and I just started frequenting their community. It’s a way to get to meet both beginners and veterans of programming.

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That is true to some what extent, But I was in a level where I do not know that I do not know and I cannot search about something that I do not know about. I lacked the minimum required knowledge level.

Thank you in general and thank you specifically about the last two paragraphs, please have a nice day :innocent: Mrs. Ilenia.

30

Jump on the discord and ask something like “I was doing React projects on CodePen, what do I need now if I want to build them locally?” and someone will come along and suggest Create-React-App or something, and so on.

Or “I was doing HTML/CSS projects, now I want for that image to appear and disappear pressing a button, what should I learn?” and someone will point to JavaScript and specifically DOM manipulation, and later React or any frontend framework.

Tutorial hell is one of the most dangerous pit-falls.

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I am sorry, I must have been missing something:

  1. Is “Virtual Coffee community” this website?
  2. What discord server are you mentioning here because I do not know that FCC has a discord server.

Regarding “Tutorial Hell”, yes I made this mistake in the past but recognized soon that I am not really learning anything and I started to search for interactive programs, FCC is one of them just like OSSU. But the problem is that OSSU is so long (because they compromised nothing when they made up the curricula).

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Yes, that is the site.
They have meetings on tuesdays and thursdays were we talk about tech.
They also have a very active slack channel.
You can find all of the information about joining here

freeCodeCamp has a discord and chat.

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33

10x dev

10x developers do exist. But they’re not what you’ve been told they are. A 10x dev is simply more impactful than a regular developer. It’s not about cranking out code or being more “productive”. It’s about intuitively grokking problems quicker, and more precise than their peers. And the larger the scale of the problem, the bigger the edge.

Check out this answer on quora

Now here’s the thing. You don’t have to be a 10xer to found a startup.

I learned to code in under 1 year, founded a startup, and have since been employed at vmware.

I am not a 10xer by any means.

You just have to be proficient and dedicated to learning. I doubt the problem you intend to solve requires you to be a 10xer anyways. And if it did, then you’ll need funding to hire other top devs because going solo just won’t cut it at that level.

Also keep in mind that when Zuckerberg started Facebook it was just a simple website anyone of us could build.

big tech

Now about getting into big tech, you’ll need to change your mindset. Like I said I work at vmware and they don’t use the word programmer. At that level they consider themselves engineers.

Why do I say that? Because that’s what the
OSSU path is teaching you. How to engineer. At those big companies you will focus less on code, and more on process, architecture and impact. It’s pretty much a given everyone there can write code.

Things are much, much, slower here. It’s not unheard of for a simple change to a button to take a week to merge. Why? Because with over 200 devs working on the same 3 million LOC repo, and 100s of millions of dollars per month on the line, the number of checks required increases significantly. Because no one can possibly have the full context to make a decision that a change will require.

You’ll have to crank out more code and build more at smaller companies. So if you want to get “faster” at delivering features, that’s where you want to be.

And smaller companies can pay decently as well. Not as much as big tech, but life, like software engineering, is about tradeoffs.

getting into big tech

Now, if you’re still interested in getting into larger companies, then learn as much about best practices as you can. Build as many projects as you can. And leetcode.

Then you could look for referrals, or what I recommend, apprenticeships. Which are 1 year contracts with the possibility of converting to fill time after. That specifically target diversity and inclusion, which applies for self taught devs.

Onramp is a good company for this. Companies have closed their apprenticeships for the year, but follow them on Twitter to be informed when they start up again

https://twitter.com/onramp_io

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34

I find the mythos of becoming a 10x developer harmful. I don’t want to be or work with someone who thinks of themselves as better than everyone. I want to work with team players. Some people have more experience. Some people have less experience. Just focus on being a good team player and building up experience.

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i’m not an expert on software. but i think faang people are hardworking special people. they have mindset and wisdom on their jobs. so -say if am wrong- they are on the merit in what they are doing.

i think the best way to learning is doing. a lot of doing.

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Just because someone is better, does not mean they have nasty egos or aren’t team players. In fact, some of the smartest people I’ve worked with have been super humble. If you read the quora link in my previous reply, you’ll see I’m not alone in that assessment.

There is also an objective truth as to whether someone is better than another. No one claims LeBron James or Tom Brady are somehow equal to their peers. They are 10xers in their field and they know it. They also lift others up around them. And also understand that without a solid team, they wouldn’t have their reached their accomplishments. The same is true in software.

I agree that a nasty ego should be avoided, and some self-proclaimed 10xers have dramatically unqualified egos.

But I’ve also found that many people shy away from being around so called 10xers, or even 2xers because of their own insecurities. So outright dismissing someone’s drive is a gross over adjustment to a previous bad experience (which usually is just an implied one)

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37

Times are different, back in the days, things were much simpler and required much less experience than nowadays.

And thank you really for your extremly impactful, right on point advice. I really wish you an incredible day :slight_smile:

Nope, that is not what it means, i do not -by any means- undermine people with less experience, but in fact, i try to help as much as possible. But as aforementioned, sometimes beggars can’t be choosers, I though that i need to be a 10x but @JM-Mendez said that this is not required.

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I’m not dismissing a drive to be a better developer. I’m just dismissing the toxic connotations and mythos around the term 10x developer. There is a huge difference between someone who strives to be a valuable member of development teams and someone who strives to be a 10x developer. I only want to be and work with one of those.

You can re-define 10x all you like, but that doesn’t change the connotations for those of us who have met self proclaimed 10x devs.

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I’m currently being mentored by FAANG level engineers at formation.dev. And I can honestly say that just their poise and the way they speak about tech is miles above what I thought possible.

These are easily 2-5xers, if not more, than most. And yet they are the humblest engineers I’ve ever met.

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…self proclaimed 10x devs.

I see that you’re skipping right over me having addressed that point, and stuck with your own conclusions.

Why?

There is a huge difference between someone who strives to be a valuable member of development teams and someone who strives to be a 10x developer.

Because the 2 are not mutually exclusive. A person can be a 10xer at a small company, but average at FAANG. So a person could strive for FAANG level ability, while still being a team player.

Like I said, LeBron James and Tom Brardy are 10xers, and team players

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41

I have several problems with this entire concept:

First, it doesn’t work to say “you can be a 10x developer if you completely redefine the term”. 10x developer is a term in active use with connotations. Those aren’t great connotations.

Second, I firmly reject the idea that a single developer is just 10 times better than others on the team. The core mythos of a person that is more valuable than other people reduces people to their monetary worth to a company or team. Some people have more knowledge and skills than others. That doesn’t make them ‘more valuable’ as a human. It just means they have more knowledge and skills. You still need the entire team to write software.

Third, I don’t want to be or work with a 10x developer or rockstar or whatever other terms people use. I’ve met people who think they are 10x better than others or want to think this or want to become 10x better than everyone else. These are not pleasant people.

Rather than buying into the 10x mythos, I recommend focusing on being a good developer who gains knowledge and experience while being a collaborative member of a team. Just be good at your job and proud of your work and then go be a human with the rest of your time. Work so you can live rather than living just to work and generate profit and grind away.

I’ve just decided that the term ‘crab developer’ means everything I said above. It isn’t what people mean when they say crab, but I aspire to be a crab.

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43

OK, you obviously just keep skipping right over points I’ve made because you wish to stick with your conclusions.

Yes. 10xer has a connotation. Which I’ve already redefined before expanding on it.

To not agree with my redefinition is one thing.

But you instead insist on keeping your definition, in order to attack my point.

That’s called building a strawman.

You’ve yet to make any solid arguments against my actual point, and instead seem to be arguing with yourself.

That’s fine, do you. But I therefore will not further engage unless you’re genuine about having a discussion.

But if you have any salient counter points to make, I’ll listen

Edit:
To be clear, my arguments werr

  1. what a real 10x dev is (more about impact st scale)

  2. That OP didn’t need to be a 10xer to found a startup

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That what @JM-Mendez said, you are biased to your own experience without looking objectively, other scenarios (that you clearly did not encounter) contains things that are quite opposite (humble 10x).

I think you actually agree with him but you use same term with different meaning.

This is called False Causality, Coorelation As Causation.

False Causality means that you thought that people “who claim that they are 10x” is the reason for their “ignorance and bad team worker”, Co-relation As Causation is because “you thought that because they happen together means one is the cause of the other”, actually… it might be a false co-relation.

PS: if False Causality or Co-relation As Causation is not understood, i can further Elaborate.

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And if you redefine the term, you are no longer talking about the same thing. That’s fine. But don’t expect people to automatically agree with your redefinition.

Everyone who has objected to 10x developer in this thread uses the common meaning of the term. I use the common meaning. I don’t see any value in redefining terms with common meanings. It only creates confusion.

This is why I proposed the different term for the different concept we are discussing that is not at all a 10x developer - a ‘crab developer’. Different meanings should use different words.

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